SPEAKER_03 0:00

I was playing well, I was two sets to love up and I just literally broke him in the third set and he missed the backhand. Yeah. And then just got the ball out of his pocket and absolutely melted it at the uh umpire and it hit his eye.

SPEAKER_01 0:17

Kyle Edmund is a former professional tennis player who reached a career-high singles world ranking of number 14, and he became the British number one during one of the most competitive eras in modern tennis. A semi-finalist at the Australian Open and winner of an ATP tour title, Kyle built his reputation on explosive power, physical resilience, and a relentless competitive mindset. He competed against the very best in the world, represented Great Britain in Davis Cup, and experienced both the highs of Grand Slam breakthroughs and the challenges of long-term injury. On Beyond Tennis, the format is simple. In the first part of the conversation, we're going to dive into Kyle's tennis journey. In the second part, we will learn a bit more about what matters beyond the sport of tennis. For Kyle, that passion is sport, namely football and his love of Liverpool. Welcome to Beyond Tennis, and I'm glad you're here. So, Kyle, thanks for coming in. Thanks, Joanny. Great to be here. Have you done many podcasts before? No, one of uh one of my first ones. This is gonna be one of the best ones that you will ever do. Exactly. Okay, so on Beyond Tennis, we we go through the careers. Um I'm gonna go through a bit of a fine-toothed comb of your excellent playing career. Yeah, um, you recently stopped playing. What have you been up to since you stopped?

SPEAKER_03 1:27

Yeah, I stopped in August of last year. Yeah, 25. Yeah, and just took some time to you know to get over it, reflect. Which you probably needed after all the years on tour. Exactly, yeah. And it's it is um amazing, really, actually, when you do reflect, you it's the first time I really look back and appreciated what what happened because when you're in it, you I don't think you appreciate as enough as as you probably should, but you do sort of reflect and it's like, right, this is the end, I have my career, I can look upon now. Yeah, and uh you've got to be very proud of it, it's been an excellent career, mate. Yeah, thank you. But it was it was good to do and um sort of slowly get not take the emotion away, but just it's quite emotional decision, so you just kind of um you know come out the other end a bit and some point you start to then look ahead. It's like what what is my future hold now? And then you start to look, what am I interested in? What can I can I see myself doing? And that's kind of been the bulk of this time now that I've been uh looking looking ahead.

SPEAKER_01 2:28

Good, good, good. Well, as I said, you had an excellent career, so we're gonna start right from the beginning. I saw that you were born in Johannesburg, yeah. But let's start off when did you first get a tennis racket in your hand? When did the tennis journey begin?

SPEAKER_03 2:39

I mean, it probably begun when I was 10. I mean, I'd always been sporty in my career in school, done lots of sports, but um yeah, tennis at 10 up in Beverley in East Yorkshire. Yeah, um, Richard Pleuse, which I still see today, um, still helps out the uh in British tennis.

SPEAKER_01 2:57

Excellent junior coach. Exactly.

SPEAKER_03 2:58

Um, so yeah, he was running basically summer camps, and me and my sister were out of school, yeah, and my mum said, you know, you're not gonna be home all summer.

SPEAKER_01 3:08

Sorry, what age did you start?

SPEAKER_03 3:09

Ten. Ten. Yeah, yeah. And um, not gonna be home all summer, why don't you go and do the summer camp? And it basically all started from there. I went down to the um Beverly Tennis Club, yeah, um, Seven Corners Lane, it's called, and uh yeah, started there, and it was after the summer camp, Richard kind of said to my parents, why don't you why don't you think about playing a bit more? Yeah, and um that's when I went to the David Lloyd and started doing some squads after school.

SPEAKER_01 3:38

So you're now kind of training after school from what 10 till about 12, 13?

SPEAKER_03 3:43

Um just kind of thinking you then you moved into probably even 10 to maybe um 11 or 12 because Richard then left Hull and then my coach became John Black. Yeah, um another excellent junior coach, exactly, and um it was good with John because I did a lot a lot of growing up, like he was very good on the court and teacher, but also um developed me from like a bit of a child to like a young man, yeah, you would say.

SPEAKER_01 4:09

So and a lot of what ages were you with were John with?

SPEAKER_03 4:12

Um in Hull was probably around 12 to 13. Yeah, but then at 30 I went to Bishop Abbey, yeah, 13 till 16, but John was also my coach there. Yes. Um, so yeah, it kind of all started from there uh lessons before school, 6:30 till eight in the morning, go to school, then squads after school. Yeah. And then at 13, when I went to Bishop, that's where it was that from school to tennis, we came tennis and school, it was like because of the tennis sort of overtook a little bit.

SPEAKER_01 4:40

Exactly. School you're doing more tutor stuff, yeah, rather than actual school, which at that age was um and what what was your so you within this series we're looking at people kind of junior career going into their senior career. What was your daily training looking like between let's say 14 and 16? What was your average day looking like?

SPEAKER_03 5:00

Um, most of it was two squads a day, yeah. Probably like an hour and a half to two hours. I mean it and then you had school around that. So sometimes you may wake up early and play, literally like 6:30. You're playing schools like nine till two or something, or nine to twelve, and then you're playing towards the end of the day gym fitness. Yeah. At that age, it was the first time I started to do fitness as well. Like I'd never done a training block, a physical block, yeah, before the age of like 14, 15. So I remember my first physical block was at Bisham. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 5:35

Um, and are you what you're starting to think that you might get out of your tennis career when you're 15, 16?

SPEAKER_03 5:40

Yeah, even I suppose when I went to Bishop, it was I never really thought about playing professionally kind of by making that decision going to Bisham. You're then like, okay, I'm committing to this now, I'm doing this properly. Yeah. And you start to think about being more professional. I mean, not proper professional, you're still mucking around a bit.

SPEAKER_01 6:00

But um well, look, I went I I I was working in sports management around about 2008, and I remember Martin Lee, my friend, actually mentioning I said to him, 'Are you working with any good juniors?' And he said, Your name when you were 14, 15, and he said you've got a great attitude and professionalism, even at that age. So that's something he spotted quite early on.

SPEAKER_03 6:20

Yeah, that was something that was one of my strengths, some of my characters, and I I would have got that from my parents basically. They yeah, one of the first things my dad um did when I went and played tennis was he he said uh if you throw your racket, you're never playing tennis again. Like Rafa. Yeah, yeah. My dad was one of those guy guys. If he said something, it was like he he meant it. So I was like, Yeah, I bet Steven, yeah. He's uh he's not he's been serious here, so I listened to him, and it's not that's just one little thing, but it was that sort of discipline, yeah, discipline and um going in that direction and always drilling into me that um I was sporty, so I had some sort of talent, but they said hard work is the talent is nothing without hard work, so yeah, that was always my mindset of doing those things, and uh yeah, I've always had that in my careers and to to give myself the best chance.

SPEAKER_01 7:13

And when did you start playing internationally in the juniors? When did you first first start playing at foreigners?

SPEAKER_03 7:18

Probably 14 because you obviously have the tennis Europe and the 14s tour, and that was probably the first time going away. Um, maybe like Tarbs, yeah, stuff like that.

SPEAKER_01 7:30

Yeah, uh so you're already kind of one of the better ones, and you're one of the best kids in the country for your age.

SPEAKER_03 7:34

I was never the best, but I was one of the best because I think 10 is a bit of a late start. So I was for a period, I was always playing a bit of catch-up, yeah, and uh yeah, I was never the best, but look, the 1995 year was quite strong. Yeah, we had probably seven or eight of us that could have played in those international tournaments, yeah. Um, like Luke Bambridge, Johnny Omar, Evan Hoyt, uh big international tournaments. Mahaven Morsey, yeah, Harry Edwards, Billy Harris. Yeah, of course, yeah. Um, so some so it was a good age group to to push each other.

SPEAKER_01 8:06

Well, actually, fast forwarding a little bit, I noticed you you won junior Davis Cup, so the under 18 Davis Cup with that. Who else was in the team then?

SPEAKER_03 8:13

Yeah, Evan and Luke. Evan and Luke. Yeah, we had actually uh under 16, I think, is that age group, but we had actually won the Winter Cup with three other guys, yeah. And and then the summer cup, um, myself, Luke, and um Evan, summer cup and then Junior Davis Cup, which just showed how strong, strong we were as an you're now kind of getting some international success.

SPEAKER_01 8:37

You must now start be dreaming about your what your professional career might look like.

SPEAKER_03 8:41

Yeah, at that age, you're certainly already thinking you're training like a professional, you're thinking like a professional, or you're trying to anyway. You're obviously it's a big age to grow up and and learn a lot of the fundamentals. And um, I was at that age when I was 16, I was at the National Tennis Centre as well, working with Colin Beecher. Yeah, who's an excellent day? Excellent. Yeah, I knew I wasn't a person that shouted out loud or and sorry, this is 16. Yeah, yeah, was uh a centre of attention, but I always had like a inner confidence, quite inner confidence that um I was a good player, believed in myself, I believed that I could always keep improving, and that's the way my sort of career trajectory went is like I I didn't shoot up straight away, but I never kind of stopped or plateaued, I slowly went up the levels and kept kept going through them from juniors futures challenges.

SPEAKER_01 9:35

A lot of this series, um and I'm asking everyone that I speak to, yeah, is how they make that transition from juniors to seniors. Um, and we've had a kind of different guests giving different perspectives, but one of the the things that I've I've been hearing quite a bit of is is the dangers of spending a bit too much time at futures level. Yeah, so you get stuck, you can get stuck, yeah. So obviously some of the people have kind of gone through that very, very quickly. Yeah, how did you find that transition from juniors into seniors? And how long were you down at the futures level before you broke into the tour?

SPEAKER_03 10:06

Yeah, I can't remember the time. I got my first point when I was 17. Okay. In uh Mercia, and um I remember making the final of a challenger when I was 19. Okay, yeah, yeah. So in that time I'd kicked on, and that was John Black, even when he was teaching me in the ju um even below juniors, but like you know, 13, 14, he'd always say to me, You don't want to spend more than 18 months in the futures. Okay, yeah. So he was already telling me back then, like getting me in the position and the mindset, yeah. You to kick on through that, you need to have the game, you need to have weapons. And this was all in and one thing you did have was a weapon, you definitely have the big forehand, and um that that was it. So he's kind of preparing me when you get in in that um futures tour, you can get easily stuck, and once you get stuck, you can become uh messed in their bit of journey, and um yeah, well, I think that was a big thing.

SPEAKER_01 11:01

My brother said one of the things as well is sometimes the bad habits that you can become across at that junior level. If you've come out of playing all the junior Grand Slams, playing those futures sometimes you can kind of get a bit stuck with the journeyman pros, maybe not doing things exactly professionally.

SPEAKER_03 11:14

It's just one of those if you you want to get in and want to get out, you want to go in, get experience, learn, but you need to get through because no one respectably no one plays tennis to play futures, like they're playing to play on the track.

SPEAKER_01 11:29

And just for the people at home listening, what sort of ranking do you need to do? Do you need to get before you can kind of move into the higher level tournaments to get out of futures? Um what's what kind of ranking?

SPEAKER_03 11:39

Realistically, probably 400. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 11:43

Um so once you're kind of in the threes, you're looking at challenges.

SPEAKER_03 11:46

Yeah, you're playing challenges. You may still play some 25s. I mean, back then for me it was 10,000 uh 10k's and 15k's, and now it's 15, 25. Yeah. Um, but you want to get through that quickly. Um I always find it's okay to have a mix, but if you have the opportunity to get into those tournaments, yeah, do it because you want to be getting through, like you want to be getting that experience soon. Exposure to that higher level, yeah. And the level that's the thing, the exposure and testing yourself, but you don't want to get too comfortable. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 12:19

Was it something you were known for? Was your your forehand? It was an absolute monster forehand. When was that first something that you developed, or is that something that you were all because I didn't know you were a junior player. I kind of I saw it when it was already pretty, pretty big time on the on the on the tour. So when did you first start developing that?

SPEAKER_03 12:38

All all along. I mean, even probably even if you ask uh Richard or John, my forehand was always a weapon.

SPEAKER_01 12:43

That was always something you wanted to hit more of.

SPEAKER_03 12:45

Yeah, exactly. And I couldn't tell you why, as in why I hit it so well. Yeah, it was just something that came naturally to me. I saw saw the ball hit the ball. Yeah, I had uh an ability to create power and spin. Yeah, um, throughout the years, there's always tweaks and take backs and making sure I wasn't going too far around the grip. Yeah, but it was just something that came naturally to me.

SPEAKER_01 13:08

You were quite comfortable on clay courts as well. That is that again a conscious decision that you made to kind of get on clay courts quite young.

SPEAKER_03 13:15

Yeah, it certainly in the juniors with Colin Beecher, yeah. A lot of that junior career and futures was on clay, which is tough. It's tough, but it's also good for the development. Definitely, yeah. I didn't necessarily s think of it, oh, this is good for my development. I just saw it as like I like playing on clay and my game suits it, I get rewarded from hitting good shots. Yeah, players find it hard to get on top of me as much as they do, say, indoor hard. Yeah. Um, but yeah, I mean I started off playing on carpet with David Lloyd. Oh wow. So it's funny how it it materialised in that way.

SPEAKER_01 13:49

Well, I'm I'm not saying that it's just because you're here, but I don't think it's a controversial shout to say that probably the biggest British forehand. I'm trying to think of other British players that had a bigger forehand than you, but I can't think of many. Well, I'll tell I'll definitely take it.

SPEAKER_03 14:02

I mean, some players might have something to say, but um there was definitely a period, I'm sure you sort of talk to all the tennis players, yeah, that they have an inner confidence and a belief that they do something better than other players. Yeah, definitely. And that was certainly mine when I was on the tour. I had the belief that um my forehand could match anyone's and be better. Yeah, and there was other parts of my game that I knew wasn't maybe as good uh or as high low as my forehand, but my forehand was was the one. And on the tour, you have to have a weapon to you look at the difference, yeah. The guys on tour are not they're not mediocre at stuff. There's a reason why they're there, yeah. And it's important that you I developed something that was world-class, you'd say.

SPEAKER_01 14:47

So again, we're talking like that that that transition you said you meant be about 18 months to come out of the future to get into challenges. That that puts you at around about 20 years of age, 21 years of age.

SPEAKER_03 14:57

Yeah, no, I mean, certainly 19. I started to play challenges, and then I the year I turned 20, I qualified for Australian Open. Yeah. That in that January, yeah. I'm pretty sure. That was my first time I'd qualified. What year was that? Um 2015.

SPEAKER_01 15:15

2015, okay, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 15:16

Um, because uh the end of that year I had played David for Davis Cup. So it was a big year for me. Of course, yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 15:24

Um, I'm I'm going back a little bit because I'm just thinking, well, I know that the the 2013 you you did a pre-season with Andy in Miami, was it with James Ward as well, maybe? Yeah, yeah, one of them were. So you would have been 18 then? Yeah, absolutely. How valuable was that kind of doing a pre-season with Andy being probably number two or three in the world at the time?

SPEAKER_03 15:42

Yeah, it when you look back, it shows how huge it was because I ended up doing four or five preseasons with Andy, a few in Miami, and I think we did a couple in degree. The first one was you when you when you're 18. Exactly. But my mindset was just I have to get everything out of this. Yeah, the only thing I could control was my work ethic and my uh attitude, and that was like I'm gonna do everything I can to work, not give up, not give them a reason not to want me or put me to the side or anything, just make sure I keep turning up. Physically, how did you find it? Physically tough. Like it was the first time I had done the drills in Miami, going side to side, the times, the the heat, it was just kind of relentless in that way, which you can see why Andy did what he did in his career and the way he played, but that was his like bread and butter, yeah, and you're almost going into his world for the first time.

SPEAKER_01 16:38

Um, so did that give you confidence then kind of competing as a 19-20-year-old, knowing that you've kind of done a training with one of the best in the world.

SPEAKER_03 16:45

Absolutely. Um, for sure, physically, you come out of it um feeling confident. Getting the physical standards and improvement gives you confidence without even improving your game. Yeah, your game theoretically could be the same, but just having physical when you walk onto the court, it just gives you a bit more presence in yourself to be like, I'm here, and that was certainly something that so then you kind of fast forward to about 2015.

SPEAKER_01 17:12

You said you qualified for the for that for your first grand slam.

SPEAKER_03 17:16

Yeah, first slam. Um I think I remember who you played in the first one? I think I lost Steve Johnson straight so that's my first main draw outside of Wimbledon, yeah, because obviously I've got some wild cards in the younger one, but there's a big difference getting a wild card to earning a spot and uh lost to him, and then ended up um going from there to Hong Kong to play challenger, yeah. So I was obviously still in that zone of playing up, but um still playing high-level challenges, winning enough matches and stuff, yeah. Exactly, and um yeah, twent that year was a year where I went back and forth a few high-level challenges, dipping into tour events, yeah. Um and even before I played the uh Davis Cup at the end of the year, 2015, yeah. I went to because it was on clay in Belgium, we went to South America and was playing challenges. So I was playing Leon Tokyo on that one, yeah. Yeah, playing challenges before Davis Cup, but yeah, obviously it put me in you know a good place.

SPEAKER_01 18:13

So then 2016, are you playing at tour level? Maybe pretty pretty much after that Davis Cup win in 2015, yeah. Are you then I'm just talking about your individual career 2016-17? You're pretty much exclusively tour events, is yeah, pretty much.

SPEAKER_03 18:28

I throughout my career sometimes always dipped down to challenger to if I had a run of losses to get some confidence, yeah, or maybe I had an injury to come back. But predominantly I'd after that challenger win, I think that was the first time I went top 100. Yeah, and then which is a big kind of milestone for everyone, yeah. And then obviously top 100 you're playing on the tour, I'd I'd say so. From then on, you're getting to main draw of the the Grand Slams, yeah. Um even that year was probably the first time playing main draw of Grand Slam consistently, yeah, not going through qualifying, yeah. Um, so yeah, it was very much those years 2021, 22, 23, as like my tour years and learning age of 21, 22, yeah. Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_01 19:10

Yeah, because I said fast forward and we're looking at 2018, you made a big break through huge news, um, semi-final of the Australian Open, yeah, which was a fantastic achievement. Not many British people have reached the semi-final of a Grand Slam. Yeah. Um, yeah, talk to us a little bit about that year. What was going on what was you must have had a lot of belief.

SPEAKER_03 19:30

Yeah, I mean, so the end of the 2017, um, I just started with a new coach, Fide Rosengred, a Swedish guy who'd got a lot of tall-level experience, and I finished the year with him in Asia. Uh, we did, I think, Vienna, Bercy, and um Burcy, I was I think I was literally five on a five of up against Jack Sock in the third set, and ended up losing it. Okay, and he ended up winning the the Masters. This is uh sort of big one. Yes, yeah, yeah, remember that. So that sort of hurt, and uh you know it was not very nice to finish the season that way, but it was then like right, I'm 22, I'm starting to really push through. So we targeted the off-season and um uh we spent the off-season in Bahamas, yeah, where I obviously um spent a bit of time my career. And um I took two um guys younger than me, like Johnny Gray, Ryan Story, and I basically spent the pre-season with them. Yeah, and it was the best pre-season I had in terms of not in terms of like I worked harder, but just where my game was at. Yeah. We had a lot of hours on court doing a lot of drilling specific to me, um, improved certain areas, my movement improved a lot, yeah, and my conditioning in the in the humidity as well.

SPEAKER_01 20:49

So you're feeling strong at the end of that.

SPEAKER_03 20:51

We go five sets, and even in that offseason, we we once played a five set match, regardless of the score. Yeah, and a couple times I think we even played four sets, yeah. So, which you don't do very often, but it was just like we're really hitting it, and I I went from the Bahamas straight to Australia 2018. Yeah, um, feeling like really ready. Yeah, um, and uh yeah.

SPEAKER_01 21:14

And what what what was the week before?

SPEAKER_03 21:16

Brisbane, yeah. And uh I beat Sh Chung first round, yeah. Shapovalov, yeah, and then I was playing Grigor, yes, and I lost in three sets. Um I actually I rolled my ankle in that match, yeah. Um and sort of I finished the match, but it was a bit swollen stuff, which yeah, I've had to miss Auckland. Yeah, but I think it actually did me a favor in the end because I got some matches under my b under my belt, my ankle improved, yeah, and I went into Aussie open in like a a really good space. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 21:48

Um and what what to do talk to me as as you're going through, because I've seen known a few people that are kind of yeah, work their way through a grand slam, but how how how did your mindset change as the tournament developed?

SPEAKER_03 21:59

Um Hugely like he I went I didn't start the tournament thinking about anything further down the line as in the rounds because my first match was Kevin Anderson and he had made final of the US Open the year before. Yeah, yeah, he was a big time player, and it was just about that basically. I'd I played him before, I think, once in French, but never beaten him. Yeah. And um I just knew it was gonna be a hard match, but it was like I'm I'm ready. Yeah, the only thing that was the massive thing for me was sermon return. Yeah, but off the ground I backed myself and fitness-wise, and uh yeah, I won in um five sets.

SPEAKER_01 22:39

Okay, so now you get that's big big belief. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 22:42

Going to the next round, I played Istamin. Yeah, another good player, another good player, but it was just I felt like I'm I'm here now. Like on the court, I don't feel like it can hit through me as much because I'm moving well, yeah. And I played so much tennis after the five sets that I was just in such a good place seeing the ball. Yeah, as the rounds went on, I had a a gruelling match with Bastlashvili in the third round.

SPEAKER_01 23:07

Another nasty player.

SPEAKER_03 23:08

Yeah, that was five sets, and uh at one point I think it reached 40 degrees on court, which is the hottest I'd ever played. People frying eggs on there, yeah. And actually in the the fourth set, um, we played a 20-minute first. So what round is Bastelashville? Third round. Third round, go, yeah. In the fourth set, we played a 20-minute first game where I managed to come through. Is it daytime? Yeah, so I think we're first done. Yeah, and I remember thinking I've just got to get through this psycho psych psychologically, and I got through it, and then you just tanked the rest of the fourth. Beautiful. So I was like, we're gonna get ready for the fifth, yeah, and uh, but I started cramping, yeah. So I said uh all I'm gonna do is I'm just gonna focus on my service games, yeah, and see what happens in the return games. So I focused on my service games, used all my energy for the survey, and then just kind of cut through it, which is something I've never really done in my career, but I was like, I've just got to do it, I've got no other choice. And then if I said if I got to 30 or something on his serve, then I'll invest and put in the effort.

SPEAKER_01 24:10

Yeah, and then I think again, it's not good for juniors.

SPEAKER_03 24:13

No, but you know, that's what had to happen. And I think I got him, I broke him to win 6-4. Yeah, um, but by this time you're in such a different mindset in your game, you're your game's flowing, yeah, not necessarily thinking about tactics, they're just happening. Yeah, the plays on court, the tactics, they're just drilled into you. It's like you know when to go line, you know when to stay in rallies, yeah, you know when to take it on, you're not necessarily thinking about it so much. And um by that point when I played Seppi and the fourth round, yeah, and Gregor on the course, yeah, my game was just flowing. It was just about making good decisions and feeling good on the court, staying focused, as in the only thing that could go wrong was concentration or getting yours getting myself getting in the way.

SPEAKER_01 24:58

And something you you won't remember, but it was because you're obviously in Australia, but back home, people would have been kind of the the the attention on you would have been going up quite a lot, yeah. And you might not have noticed that being in Australia, but I remember being in the UK and everyone talking about that run because it would have been probably one of the first runs into the latter stages that wasn't Andy Murray's exactly for the few years. So so how did you find kind of extra focus and attention and kind of inevitable comparisons with Andy?

SPEAKER_03 25:27

Yeah, it was it was just all about embracing it, really. Um I was kind of aware of it, and as the rounds go on, there's a bit more media attention. But when you're on the tour, it's it is ex to be expected. That's what's happened. The only thing that was slightly different is um but like back home, people uh reporters would turn up at my parents' house, were they, which they hadn't done before and they hadn't done after, so it's just kind of that moment.

SPEAKER_01 25:55

Yeah, um quite a private family, I guess, as well.

SPEAKER_03 25:57

Yeah, exactly. But it it was fine, like it's a good problems, yeah, and all part of being a professional athlete.

SPEAKER_01 26:05

But um, I remember I remember all the cameras coming to Bisham Abbey because it was an ex-bishop boy, so I remember having to deal with the the yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_03 26:14

Everyone wants a bit of a story of what he's like as a bird growing up, but it it was fine, it was just um so yeah, fantastic.

SPEAKER_01 26:23

And we we kind of skipped past something I was reading last night and I totally forgot about it, but Davis Cup. So when Britain won the Davis Cup in 2015, I forgot a little stat that you made your debut in the final, yeah, which is pretty crazy. Only six people in history have made their final their Davis Cup debut in a final.

SPEAKER_03 26:46

Yeah. How did you find that? I think one of them is the only reason I remember is MacEnroe.

SPEAKER_01 26:51

MacInro did that as well, didn't but I I can't remember who the others were, but yeah, I didn't look up, I just saw that you were they you were part of a group of six people in history.

SPEAKER_03 26:58

Yeah, um it kind of just came from that trip I'd referenced to in South America that Leon said, you know, we we've got to do this seriously, and on the tour, the year finishes on the indoor hardcourts. Yeah, so he said we've got to go out to Amer um South America, get on the clay. They had a few challenges out there, yeah. So myself and James Ward were going out there. I think one other person was there as well. Yeah, but um it started from there, but I I played great, like I won in two sets up on Goffin. Yeah, yeah, I did, but in Buenos Aires, I won Buenos Aires Challenger, and um he came home before me. But it was actually in I landed in a Heathrow, um, knowing that I'd kind of go to Davis Cup, but I didn't know in what capacity, yeah, and all the sort of tires before. I might have been like a little bit in contention, but not really like you've been in the team many, many times. A bit of a water boy, a bit of a hitter. Yeah, and Leon would always respectfully like let me know and be like, Great. This is why I'm thinking, yeah, um, I'm going this direction. And um, but he called me basically. I was in a taxi from the airport going to my flat, yeah. And he called me, he said, uh, yeah, after watching you and the tense you've been playing, I'm I'm picking you. Yeah. And um you played a great match, to be fair. Like, I kind of couldn't like I was surprised he picked me. I I thought he wasn't going to because one of the sort of reasons I wasn't playing was experience, yeah. And in experience in table. And it was like looking back now, it's like, wow, fair, you know, fair play. He trusted me and believed in me to go out in the final and play. And um, and you played great, I was there that day. I played great, started off. I started off amazingly, just finished poorly, unfortunately. But but top ten in the world, he was at the time, yeah. It was um for my career, it was a great experience because it was um one of those it was like invaluable lesson to go into a uh high pressure like that and play and expose yourself and see what I've got, and my game is obviously in a good place, but lots of learning to come from it to improve on to be an established tour player.

SPEAKER_01 29:11

Yeah, and and how did you find what's it what what the difference between playing in a team and an individual? Did you enjoy being part of a team?

SPEAKER_03 29:19

Yeah, I loved it, and I think you speak to a lot of the players on the GB team, they they always say they love it. It's very rarely that people don't enjoy it or don't enjoy that sort of making it.

SPEAKER_01 29:29

I think Leon Smith's done a great job and Colin Beecher of getting everyone together in the team.

SPEAKER_03 29:32

Leon's a very good man, manager person, yeah, and not getting knowing when to get involved and not to get involved too much, leaving you to it. And um, he's done a good job of of getting the team together over the years in that way.

SPEAKER_01 29:45

Yeah. Um, and then and fast forwarding you've you've had a lot of difficulties with injury towards the end of your career. When was the first kind of period in your career where that started appearing, the injuries?

SPEAKER_03 29:59

Uh it was unfortunately in 2018. Yeah. Um, the last tour I played in Antwerp, yeah, which was my first tour win. Yeah. Um, so I got it there, but in the semis, um, I just felt something and said to my trainer. It was just I said, Yeah, my knee feels a bit funny. Yeah. And it's kind of like, okay, had a bit of swelling in there. Yeah. Um but it was like my body was fine, it wasn't sore, and I was in a great place, obviously won the tournament over the moon.

SPEAKER_01 30:29

What's your ranking here?

SPEAKER_03 30:30

Probably in the twenties. Okay, so top 30 in the world, yeah. And then um felt so employed, and then that was the last time I played that year. I pulled out of Vienna, and then I was scheduled to have my tonsils out, unfortunately, ended that year, so I did get them out. And then because I took two or three weeks off, I then came back to pre-season. Obviously, um fitness wasn't quite there. So the end of 2018, this is yeah, and then um when I started moving and doing stuff, I was like, oh, it's this is no good. Like I'm in pain here, yeah. And it kind of started from there. Um, where I took that 2019 year, kind of managing it, injections, um, trying to do everything I can to avoid surgery because that's the last thing you want.

SPEAKER_01 31:16

So, how long were you off competing that whole year, pretty much?

SPEAKER_03 31:18

No, I I just played, but I played through it, always trying to do the rehab. In I had a few injections through it. I went to Australia, yeah. I think I played Birditz first round and just was not there. Yeah. And all the way through, really, um, just was a bit of a struggle. But I managed to get wins and maintain a ranking where I was thinking I was maybe 30, 40 in the world. Just a fantastic effort. Um, and then it was it was then at the start of 2020, um, I'd changed, coached, uh, gone to Frank of Davine. Yeah. And then um I spent off season Miami with him, yeah, went to Australia, it was kind of okay, and then um I managed to get a win in the New York Open. Okay, that's my second tour win. Indoor one, was that the indoor one? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Exactly. And um, yeah, that was when COVID all happened, went to Acapulco, yeah. Last tour I played, and it was kind of through COVID, the end of 2020, I just was quite fed up with everything.

SPEAKER_01 32:18

I was gonna say mentally that's a lot to take on when you're when you're performing so well on the tour, getting results, yeah, and then to have that kind of it was two tours of kind of just dealing with it and trying to.

SPEAKER_03 32:30

And how did you deal with that? Just by trying to get on with it, and yeah, probably quite a bit of moaning, um, having interventions that weren't surgical and a lot of rehab, like was being told you just need to get stronger, you need muscles support it, yeah, need to get it stronger, and I was trying to do as much as I can, but I just in the end, I was just like, I need I want something to happen, and that's why, yeah, start end of 20 uh 20, start of 2021, I had my first operation. Yeah. Um and yeah, that was kind of the start from that start of end of 2020 to the next time I played was 20 months out, which is kind of crazy, really.

SPEAKER_01 33:14

As a professional athlete, it's just you know, looking back yeah, that you don't want to brush over that because that is super, super difficult to deal with.

SPEAKER_03 33:22

Yeah, difficult. There's no there's no doubt about it. It was it was tough, and you have a lot of thoughts in your head and you're a lot of sort of quiet moments. Angry? Yeah, anger, disappointed, frustrated, um, why me? Yeah, this isn't fair, uh, I don't deserve this. Yeah, all those.

SPEAKER_01 33:41

Well, I mean, those statements you make are totally fair. I remember coming into the NTC a few times, and there couldn't be anyone working harder doing more for their career. So I'd always kind of think to myself, gosh, you know, this guy deserves a fresh run on the tour, like more than anyone I can think of, pretty much in British tennis.

SPEAKER_03 33:58

Yeah, and that was kind of one thing I promised or said to myself, it says no matter what, I have to I have to give myself every chance as and look at every avenue that I can how I can get better, and whatever comes at the end, I need to know that I can say I did everything I could, and obviously one of them is effort and work ethic, and obviously maybe trying other stuff, but that was the only thing, and that was when I made my decision to retire.

SPEAKER_01 34:27

What when? I was gonna say, when was that when did that that thought come into your mind?

SPEAKER_03 34:31

I don't really know, it was I just sort of comb back to the August when I made my decision. There was I was I didn't really want to make the decision, but one part of me was like, I know I've given everything in that way, and I can't speak to my trainer, my coach, my parents, and go, Yeah, there was something else I kind of left. No regrets, yeah. The thoughts was um they weren't like necessarily thoughts of making decision, but they were kind of like thoughts as a whole of your career, as in you look at it, this is where I am now, this is my ranking, how fast am I improving, and you just you're thinking about but not really thinking about it. It's it's like you can't con yourself, yeah. You know, yeah, yeah, you've got to be real.

SPEAKER_01 35:22

Well, I again I remember obviously seeing you training so hard at the NC to get back, but yeah, I remember thinking to myself very difficult for you having reached such highs, you know, being a part of a Davis Cup winning team, semi-final of a grand slam, and then I'm going forward to like 24, maybe 25, and you're having to play the lower level tournaments again. Yeah. Now I know a few players that have had to do that in in history, but it's not easy that it's not. How are you finding that kind of period trying to get back in the lower level of tournaments?

SPEAKER_03 35:53

Yeah, I I was okay with it at the time because I in my career I've never been one to in that way have a big enough ego that says I just can't do this, I'm better than this. Yes, it's like I knew I had to do it to come back. I had my protected rankings that are easy to do. It's part of your process, but my I knew I had to play down to get back up, and um that was okay with me at the time and stuff, and but it's not easy, you know. You're going from playing on centre court Wimbledon, playing later rounds and grand slams, this stuff, you've it probably experienced fine financially a lot better, yeah. Um and but that was kind of I'd worked so hard to get there, it was like I'm not now gonna get my in the way of myself to be like, I'm gonna be able to do it.

SPEAKER_01 36:42

And are you fully 100% like your body? You you're starting to doubt then your body. Yeah. Are you starting when when do you start to think maybe I can't get back up to what I could do physically?

SPEAKER_03 36:53

Um it's just kind of a for me the way my decision, I came to my season was accumulation. Yeah. And it kind of that answers the question in terms of it was accumulation over time. Yeah. That my body was never the same in terms of how it felt, and I always I always played on pain, yeah. Various, very levels of pain, but I had always pain playing. Amazing. And um I did stuff to try and get the pain away. I had uh like something called nerve ablation, yeah. So basically go in and put needles on your nerves and zap them to try and take away the pain receptors, and yeah, and it helped, but it's it's not good for you long. That what you did and everything you went through and you prepare to do, but one thing we know is you would have done absolutely everything.

SPEAKER_01 37:42

Um okay, so yeah, you had a bit of time now to kind of reflect on your on your career, and again, I'm I've I've said it a few times you can be super, super proud of what you've done. Um, going forwards, I mean I've got no doubts that you can kind of do anything you want in the tennis world. Um you mentioned that you'd like to maybe get into some of the business side of things.

SPEAKER_03 38:00

Yeah, it's I'd no idea when I stopped what I wanted to do. Not many people do, yeah. No, and I kind of you look at maybe Stan or Gay Gail Monfis, and they've said I'm playing this year and I'm retiring at the end. And for me, that is a privilege, yeah. To be able to have the ability to decide what when you want to stop at and they're what 40 and 39, yeah. Is it is incredible. Um, but mine just wasn't like that, it was kind of I made a decision, it came upon me, and then I was like, what am I gonna do? And um I think if you just look at say coaching, because I played tennis my whole life, well, from ten, it's the first time since I was ten years old that I have the opportunity to do something that isn't on the court. Yes, and that was kind of for me that was that intrigued me, that interested me, excited me, and it was like okay, what what can I do? And I'd also been told over and over again that the the skills and experiences and that you learn as an elite level athlete, yeah, a professional, carry so much with you in life and you can take into other industries. Yeah, and that that was kind of like, well, you know, I want to see that, I want to use that, and how can I use that? And um I spoke to people outside of sport, I went and did some events that were sort of sports business crossover. That's cool. Um, just tried to reach out to as many people as I could and get advice, and um in the end, um I kind of figured that I don't I see myself more in sport. I wake up thinking about that side of things more than I do, let's say trading or banking, which which a couple of people have done, but it's a completely different world. It is different, and I've thought you know you can't knock something until you try it, and I haven't tried it, but I just said even when I was in sport, I've uh tennis, I followed so many other sports, and it's like this is what I'm interested in. Like I re I'm really intrigued by the detail, how things are run, how things are.

SPEAKER_01 40:06

That leads us into beyond tennis. We talk about what your interests are off the court, and um you you've given me a lint uh a list of sports that you've been kind of really, really interested in. I know that you've had a long relationship with Liverpool FC. Yeah, where did football interests come in? When did that start?

SPEAKER_03 40:23

It just kind of started. There's no real special story, unfortunately, to it. It's just because I was born in South Africa and I moved over.

SPEAKER_01 40:30

What age were you when you came over?

SPEAKER_03 40:31

Uh like three. Okay. So it's young.

SPEAKER_01 40:33

I was three or four when I came from Spain, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 40:35

Yeah, and uh it was just kind of we moved to UK and the tea Liverpool is a team I started following for whatever reason. It was um like Michael Owen Hesley.

SPEAKER_01 40:46

I was gonna ask, so which is your kind of era, which is your which is your favourite era for Liverpool?

SPEAKER_03 40:50

Oh, my favourite would be the the Klopp, the Klopp, yeah, yeah. Yeah, um but you started off with the Michael Owen days, yeah, and those and had like uh what some bed sheets of wallpaper type vibe for for Christmas and stuff, so that was where it all started, but there's no reason it's just I followed them and and love supporting them now and devastated that Klopp's left, yeah. I couldn't believe it. And I mean Arnie Slot did well to get a title, yeah. Yeah, incredibly well. But the annoying thing was I I bloody found out um through Liam Brodie. Yeah, I was walking on court, he's like, Oh mate, you've seen the news, just dev'd. I was like, what he's like, Klopps left, and I went, No, no, no. That's worse than any of your injuries. That's worse than any of your injuries. I was like, I can't believe I'm finding out through Liam Brody.

SPEAKER_01 41:35

Did you get to go much? Have you ever been been to games much?

SPEAKER_03 41:37

I've been to games and I'm fortunate enough to go to games through my sort of tennis contacts, yeah, yeah, yeah. Exactly. Um, I bet I've go to more games actually in London than I have up north.

SPEAKER_01 41:49

I'm gonna ask you, Liverpool. Yeah, your all-time. I'm gonna go for a five aside team. Who would you say is who'd you who would you have in goal as your favourite Liverpool keeper?

SPEAKER_03 42:00

Well, Allison, for sure. That's the thing they've had so much success recently that a lot of the team is around that. But certainly okay, so five aside, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 42:10

What are the next four?

SPEAKER_03 42:12

So Allison, it's a great going what one, two, one.

SPEAKER_01 42:15

You're gonna go one, two, one, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 42:17

Well, it'd be yeah, Van Dyke. Van Dyke is the manor. Yeah, Van Dyke has to be Gerard.

SPEAKER_01 42:24

Has to be.

SPEAKER_03 42:25

Yeah. Yeah. And I'm going um it's either Salah or Suarez. Okay, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 42:33

I don't know. So one of the other, okay. Salah's Suarez was a beast.

SPEAKER_03 42:38

It was a beast was unbelievable. If you if you take him scored a hatch against Norwich every single time he played them, but yeah. I think I'd go Suarez and then um probably like someone like Alonso or maybe the thing is, I'll probably shoot myself down a bit now. I I don't know like the older era as much because I didn't watch them. Yeah, and I'll be leaving. Before your life would know they're super successful. Yeah. Dal Gleish and Hansen at the back and Robbie Fowler, all those guys, but I'll go for the teams that I've watched. Yeah, yeah. Well, that's a pretty good team. Pretty good team.

SPEAKER_01 43:11

Um, and then you you've you've listed other sports, so you do you get to attend many other sporting events? You put down F1 and I try to, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 43:18

I mean, I I love the motorsport. And so what is it about the motorsport? Just like the intensity of it, like the the energy. The volume, like it uh I love anything with an engine and going. Have you done Monte Carlo? Never done it.

SPEAKER_01 43:33

Because isn't the F1 quite close to the tour event? Sometimes it's like a week or two to four. So some of the guys that live in Monte Carlo I know go to the F1.

SPEAKER_03 43:41

They go, but so what what what event what F1s have you been to? I've been to a few Silverston, uh, I've been to a couple in Abu Dhabi. Oh wow, uh, one in Qatar, um, but even like my sister works in motorsport. Oh, does she? Yeah. Um in like sort of British junior series in Janetta, um, she runs it, and also her um husband. Is a racing driver as well. Oh wow, okay. So he's where it is. He's raced in well, he does race in British GT, he's racing Le Mon. Um this year's racing European GT, so I've gone and watched them and the various circuits like Donnington.

SPEAKER_01 44:13

Um well thanks for that. That kind of covers your career and you're beyond tennis.

SPEAKER_03 44:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 44:17

Um, what we do now is something, don't be worried, but we do what we call the match tie break. Oh, yeah. And these are the same questions, same questions that I give to everyone that comes on. Yeah. So just the first thing that comes to your mind. Uh don't have to spend too much time thinking about it, but yeah, we'll go through it. So, first, who is the greatest tennis player of all time? Djokovic. Over at Djokovic, yeah, I can't argue with the numbers. Yeah. Number two, who is your favourite tennis player of all time?

SPEAKER_03 44:43

My favourite, the the guys that I loved watching growing up were Gonzalez and Safin for whatever reason. But I love watching. Two of the biggest forehands.

SPEAKER_01 44:53

Is that linking into your game?

SPEAKER_03 44:55

I love watching Safin and sort of his my demeanor is very different to his, but I loved watching him and his game style. And he's just a cool dude as well.

SPEAKER_01 45:03

He looks great when he's uh he's coaching Rublev now, he's just kind of cool around the place. Does what he wants, exactly. Yeah, I love Marrot. Um number three. I think we might I think we might know the answer to this one, but favourite shot to hit.

SPEAKER_03 45:16

So yeah, it's I can't want to be different, but I can't really like there's no point. Is it go for it? No, no, no.

SPEAKER_01 45:23

Um let's say forehand, everybody. Yeah, forehand. Um, who's the best player not to win a grand slam? Well, best player not to win a grand slam.

SPEAKER_03 45:33

Not to win a grand slam, and this is over history. The guys I think of more recently in terms of their level, um, probably someone like Sodling or Burditch. Yeah. As in really top players that I've played. They've got one guy that I think is slightly Sodling did get final, though. Yeah, yeah. Did he not win French? No. I thought he lost to Fed. The year Fed won French. Oh, he beat Rafa, didn't he? But didn't win. Yeah, yeah, yeah. The guy I think some bit underrated that isn't as Silich as in because I've played him. I just won a US Open though. Yeah, he won the re he did win, but he reached Wimby and uh Oz final as well. Yeah, so he's what a career. And in that still play, and in that era, yeah that has been unbelievable. So but yeah, probably one of them. I mean you're gonna go sodling Burditch. Yeah, I mean you could make an argument for maybe Zverev at the minute, but yeah, I'd go those two over history.

SPEAKER_01 46:27

Good. Okay, cool. Um, this is a slightly different one. Who's the best non-professional tennis player you've met or heard of? So this is a this is somebody that's got a very good level of tennis that isn't a player. So this could be a celebrity, this could be a sporting person that you've seen or come across.

SPEAKER_03 46:42

Yeah, I mean, I'm gonna name drop please, that's the whole idea, mate. Yeah, but no, recently recently I've been fortunate enough as uh member at the Wombledoners T-Duck where I've played a few times with Oliver Glasner.

SPEAKER_01 46:55

Okay, yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 46:56

Yeah, yeah, I've heard he's so uh as a Did you you played with Dominic Tim and him, I saw recently him and Dominic against myself and guy called James Kluskey, yeah, who's a Crystal Palace supporter, so that's how the connection is made. Right.

SPEAKER_01 47:07

Um what's Oliver Glasner's level?

SPEAKER_03 47:09

It's good level, yeah. Yeah, it he plays well, he loves it, he's like so into it. Um he says he loves it because it's his chance to sort of disconnect from everything. Yeah, and we generally always play and have a bit of food afterwards, yeah. And it's I mean it's amazing to be able to chat to someone. And you get to ask him questions about football and stuff. He's so open, uh fascinating asking. And I think my brother met him recently. Stories about um when he first met Elise, yeah. Um the tactics, transfers inside the football world. I mean, how it how it links with tennis as well. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 47:41

That's that's a good one, like him, yeah. Okay, last question. Who would play you in a film about yourself?

SPEAKER_03 47:49

Um I don't know where I don't know whether it fits or you'd do it, but um I love Tom Hardy.

SPEAKER_01 47:55

Tom Hardy?

SPEAKER_03 47:56

I mean, I think everyone loves him.

SPEAKER_01 47:58

Tom Hardy's not you can't have Tom Hardy.

SPEAKER_03 48:01

Okay, Tom Hardy. Okay, we'll take it. We'll take it. His acting same physique well not really. Uh his yeah, just everything that like I think is like unbelievably good. So I was like, I'd like him to play me, but I don't think that is the right person. No, no, go with it, be confident, mate. Take it to Tom Hardy. Okay. What about you?

SPEAKER_01 48:21

Um, I I get Dom Jolly a lot on Jack Black when I had the longer hair. But um, yeah, those guys. Very good. That's your match tie break. Okay. Um, and then the finally, you're not done yet. Yeah, you're not done yet.

SPEAKER_00 48:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 48:34

I was up last night, and what I do again with everyone is I do a seven-point tie break quiz about their career. Yeah. Now, most players that I'm coaches and people that I'm speaking to have a pretty encyclopedic knowledge of their own results over the years and scores and things like that. Some have been better than others, um, some have struggled, but these this is all based around your career. Yeah. Okay, so I want you to see how well you do in this one. Yeah. Okay. So, number one, you won the junior Davis Cup in 2011. Can you tell me who you beat in your match in the final? And can you remember what the score would be?

SPEAKER_03 49:17

Yeah. I I'll give you a clue. I'm trying to think of who we played. Should I give you a lot of two countries in my head for some reason? Italy. Yeah, okay. I was gonna go to Italy or Canada. I kind of know the two players. Um I'm getting is it Napolitano I played, or Donati?

SPEAKER_01 49:37

I've got Jan Luigi Quincy here. Quincy, okay. Quincy here.

SPEAKER_03 49:40

So you if you if you didn't get the name right, you're not gonna get the score right. No, no.

SPEAKER_01 49:43

I can't I can't I can't remember. I've maybe meant straight sets a bit. 6-3-6-4. That's yeah, I'll give you that. I'll give you that. Uh question two. Your first ATP title, we spoke about it earlier, came in Brussels or Antwerp, sorry, in Belgium. Can you tell me who you beat in the final and what the score was? Yeah, Monfils. Gail Monfils, yes.

SPEAKER_03 50:01

And it was either three or four, six, seven, six, seven, six.

SPEAKER_01 50:07

I do need an exact answer, Carl.

SPEAKER_03 50:10

It wasn't a great first set. Uh let me go four, six, seven, six, seven, six.

SPEAKER_01 50:17

You were right in the first one, three, six, three, six. Three, six, seven, six. Good though. One game off. It's not bad for however many years ago. Yeah. Um, good, number three. You reached the US Open Juniors semi-final, losing out to Yeri Vessely. Yeah. Now, can you tell me what was Yuri Vessely's highest ATP ranking? Umri Vessely. He was number one in the world juniors when you played him. Yeah. But what did he go on to do in the ATP? What do you reckon he was at?

SPEAKER_03 50:47

Let's go 50 or 60.

SPEAKER_01 50:51

50 or 60. He got 35. Okay. You downplayed him there a little bit. Um, the last one, number seven. What is your Davis Cup singles record? And I'm gonna tell you that it was 11 matches that you played. And can you name the players that you beat in Davis Cup? So is it your your record was eleven matches? Can you tell me that record?

SPEAKER_03 51:16

I'm trying to think of the losses.

SPEAKER_01 51:18

No, we only talk about wins here, mate.

SPEAKER_03 51:20

Yeah. It was definitely the first I lost I lost one to Belgium, first one. I don't even write the losses down, but yeah. And Argentina. But I had good wins in Serbia. Um two of your wins were in Serbia. So two in Serbia. And I had a bunch in Madrid, three in Madrid. Mm-hmm. So can you give me some opponents here? Uh well I'm gonna go for the record. Yeah. It's either Yeah, it's six and five or seven and four.

SPEAKER_01 51:54

Six and five. So you've got a winning record, which is good. Six and five, which is fantastic. I shouldn't just say good, it's fantastic. Can you tell me the six people you beat?

SPEAKER_03 52:01

Okay, so uh Lieovich is one, yes. Tipsarovich is two. Um Kukushkin is three, Cole Schreiber is four, Feli Lopez, five, and there's one more.

SPEAKER_01 52:17

And this this one here is my favourite memory of your Davis Cup career personally. Oh, we're not getting this. I think where I played. It was uh an incredible moment in Davis Cup history. If you need any help, do let me know. There's a stat I I actually never won a home tie, don't think. I don't know where this was, but I remember watching it on TV. And it was a pretty strange end to a match. Oh yeah. Yeah, Shapovalov. Shapovalov. You should have got that, really. You should have got that. So could you let the viewers know for those of the for those that didn't watch Kyle beat Shapovalov in Davis Cup, can you let us know how that match ended?

SPEAKER_03 52:58

You could probably play it right now, but as uh it was the fifth rubber. Yeah. So we needed to win. And I was playing well, it was two sets of love up, and I just literally broke him in the third set and he missed the back end. Yeah. And then just got the ball out of his pocket and absolutely melted it at the uh umpire and it hit his eye. Mate, it was mad.

SPEAKER_01 53:19

So I when he yeah, what were you thinking?

SPEAKER_03 53:22

I made the return, he missed it, and then as he missed it, I've I've given it like the come on, yeah, and kind of like looking down changing end, yeah. And next thing I just hear this massive thud. I thought in my head, I think he smacked the ball and it's hit the like the advertising on the side, like a board, yeah, like that kind of sound. So I did that's what I think he's done, and then I've looked up and obviously seen the umpire, and then I've obviously gone like wow, but my first thought, which um probably I don't know if it's good or not, but first thought was like with one. Yeah, because I knew he was gonna get so you knew he was getting deefed. Yeah, he's just had to, but yeah, my first thought probably should have been. I mean it was again if we should say it was such a big accident, yeah. Yeah, it was horrible and like yeah, luckily the umpire was all right, yeah. Okay in the end, I actually think he might have had to see.

SPEAKER_01 54:10

And Dennis bless him, his reaction was just like, yeah, I remember looking at it.

SPEAKER_03 54:13

That was his debut, I think. Was that his Davis Camp debut? Yeah, didn't that? And that was obviously like a big learning thing, but um, yeah, just straight up with you don't we see ends matches like that. No, no, I remember watching it at home going, I've never seen anything like this. Yeah, but yeah, it was quite so surreal in the end, and then kind of what do you do? You've just won. The team are so like pumped before, like, but it's a weird feeling because we're winning. Because then you've got, but then um, it wasn't really about the win, it was about the the umpire and his health, and then you're kind of like oh great, yeah, you know, like we're looking at the water. Yeah, but it's on your record as a win, and then you go into changing. Even in the changer, everyone's kind of like looking around, like yeah, odd feeling, you know. What's what that's amazing, amazing.

SPEAKER_01 54:57

So, yeah, I'd I'd recommend everyone to go back on YouTube and then just to remind themselves of that. Um, well, Carl, it's been an absolute pleasure. Thanks very much for coming in. Yeah, thanks, and best of luck with everything that you go on. So I've no doubt you're gonna go on and conquer the business, sports business world as well.

SPEAKER_03 55:11

I hope so. Yeah, that's um a bit exciting, it's a new opportunity, a little bit scary, but it's um it's all part of life, and I look yeah, I'm looking forward to it. Top man. So thanks for having me.

SPEAKER_01 55:22

Thanks for coming in, Carl. Cheers, cheers, mate. Very good, and tune in for the next episode of Beyond Tennis. Like, subscribe, do all of that stuff. Um, really helps the channel, and uh, see you for the next episode.